joining us now, ari fleischer, cnn political contributor and former press secretary for george w. bush and bill burton, senior strategist for the top pro-obama super pac and senior legal analyst for cnn, jeffrey toobin. jeff, let me begin with you. it's a simple question but not a simple answer. tax or penalty? >> john roberts' opinion said that this penalty, tax, whatever you want to call it, this punishment, this payment, was justified under the taxing power of the constitution. that was why he approved the whole plan. that's what he said. what a bunch of politicians want to call it is the fight we're having now. >> to be really clear, if you parse the opinion, it suggests that those who don't go out and get the insurance under the new law will be punished with a tax. >> correct. that's exactly what the opinion holds. it's not a lot of people. if massachusetts is the example we're talking about, it's about 1% of the population refused to get health insurance and can afford it, those people will be punished under this law and chief justice roberts' opinion says the payment that t